Violence at hardcore shows blighted some of that era. What do remember about that?
When people saw bands like Agnostic Front and the Cro-Mags covered in tattoos they thought “macho scene” – it was to an extent, but it started more inclusive. At the first matinees I went to there were a lot of openly gay people there. Up until the mid-90s there was one guy who’d come in drag and dance in the pit the whole show. It was fuckin’ great and nobody gave a shit.
You exported New York hardcore when you started to tour…
Yeah. We wanted to show the world what we loved. That’s why we didn’t just play with hardcore bands. On our first run down the East Coast in 1988, Exodus asked us to open up for them for five shows. It was a shock to the audience when we walked out: kids with short hair! As we got more popular some people referred to us as “the kings of New York hardcore” and we were always, “no no, we’re the ambassadors.”
What’s the most unlikely gig you’ve ever played?
About seven years back we played two French festivals: one was all reggae acts, then Sick Of It All, then two guys from the Wu-Tang Clan, then another reggae act… another one was French jazz hip-hop, Sick Of It All then Millencolin. We went over great at both – it was amazing! At one there were women in cocktail dresses and high heels waving around wine classes to our music. I don’t think they went out and bought the record, but I think they loved our enthusiasm.
Hardcore bands used to be demonised for signing to major labels. Did it seem like a risk or a natural progression when you did it?
We’re a pure hardcore band but we grew up listening to rock ‘n’ roll and metal, so to us it was natural progression. We had a big internal struggle but we knew we’d just be us and do what was best. We got a little flak from the scene, but what was funnier to us was that when we [later] signed to Fat Wreck Chords we got even more stress from hardcore kids for signing to a punk label.
And these days no one really gives a shit…
Yeah! (Laughs)
The music industry in the 90s is characterised as an era of excess by today’s standards. What was your experience of it?
There were always people at majors who didn’t know what to do with us. When we were touring Built To Last, we bumped into our A&R in New York and he didn’t even know we were on tour! Moron. When we wanted to leave the major our then-manager came up with the idea that we should make ourselves so undesirable they wouldn’t to sit down and talk to us about another album. So we went on tour that summer, got the label to pay for the most expensive bus we could find, did everything to excess and they still wanted another album! In the end we told them “Nah, we just want to leave” – they were too much of a pain in the ass.
Did you make any regrettable big-money purchases with your own money?
I never bought anything big that was cool and stupid, but I never held on to my money. Even though you’re in that mindset of “This could end in a year or two”, it keeps going and you forget: you keep spending money like crazy and the well runs dry. You look at your bank account and think “why did I spend all that?!” I got a couple of cars but nothing super fancy. I would always save up to get something really nice then blow the money on something else.